<HTML><FONT  SIZE=3 PTSIZE=10>Subj:	<B> Traveller-digest V1999 #1279</FONT><FONT  SIZE=3 PTSIZE=10></B><BR>
Date:	10/30/99 6:50:28 AM Pacific Standard Time<BR>
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Traveller-digest     Saturday, October 30 1999     Volume 1999 : Number 1279<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>
All rights reserved.<BR>
<BR>
The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR>
<BR>
Re: Yet more 3D work<BR>
Re: Re Level 0 and CT<BR>
Re: [OT] One Day In Peace<BR>
Re: Yet more 3D work<BR>
Re: Yet more 3D work<BR>
Trav3D resend<BR>
re: Just say "no" to lhy for jump drives<BR>
Re: Alderson Drives and the MiGE Universe (was Re: Traveller: Aberrant jump drives (was Re: Just say "no" to lhyd))<BR>
Hi All! & Starports Question<BR>
Re: Yet more 3D work<BR>
Re: Yet more 3D work  <BR>
Re: Just say no to lhyd for jump drives<BR>
Re: Tust say "no" to lhy for Jump drives<BR>
Re: Wizard of Oz (Was Re: Traveller economics)<BR>
RE: How many contacts to span the Imperium?<BR>
Re: Yet more 3D work<BR>
Re: Yet more 3D work<BR>
Re: [OT] One Day In Peace<BR>
<BR>
----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 29 Oct 1999 22:14:16 -0700<BR>
From: Jesse DeGraff <jdegraff@pacbell.net><BR>
Subject: Re: Yet more 3D work<BR>
<BR>
ROFLMAO!!!!!  No, as far as I know Grandfather had nothing to do with it :)<BR>
There is indeed hope for you ;)<BR>
<BR>
Actually, I've mentioned before that nearly ANYONE can LEARN how to do 3D.<BR>
In it's simplest form all it is is putting together basic primatives to get<BR>
your scene.  Take a Merc Cruiser for example.  In it's simplest form, it's a<BR>
big sphere (main hull), four small spheres (main hull turrets), four medium<BR>
sized boxes (the "legs"), and four small boxes (the leg turrets).  That's<BR>
it.  All the rest of the details (what 3D folks generally call "nurnies" and<BR>
physical model shops call "greeblies") are just variations on that theme.<BR>
Other ship types are more involved, but EVERY single ship that I've ever<BR>
done started out as a box, sphere, or cone.  The rest is just subtlety and<BR>
texture mapping.<BR>
<BR>
Best,<BR>
Jesse<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
>WHAT?!  You were not gifted with an innate knowledge of how to do<BR>
everything in<BR>
>3D?  You are not some divine avatar of the god of 3D or some experiment by<BR>
>Grandfather?  There is hope for me yet.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 29 Oct 1999 22:17:21 -0700<BR>
From: Jesse DeGraff <jdegraff@pacbell.net><BR>
Subject: Re: Re Level 0 and CT<BR>
<BR>
Please give ME the Uzi SMG to play with!  Please?  Pretty please??  :)<BR>
I've shot a Cobray M11, a MAC10, and an HK MP5, but I haven't shot an UZI<BR>
('cept for a 16" barrel semi auto carbine version a LLLOOOOONNNNNGGGGG time<BR>
ago ;)<BR>
<BR>
Jesse<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
- -----Original Message-----<BR>
From: Black ICE <wombat@premier.net><BR>
To: traveller@lists.imagiconline.com <traveller@lists.imagiconline.com><BR>
Date: Friday, October 29, 1999 7:44 PM<BR>
Subject: Re: Re Level 0 and CT<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
>Jory Earl wrote:<BR>
>><BR>
>> >Later on, on page 32, in the Combat section, "Expertise:" it states<BR>
>> >"Note that all player characters have an expertise on 1/2 in all<BR>
>> >weapons. This value is sufficient to avoid the no expertise penalty..."<BR>
>> ><BR>
>> >It further explains that characters may have fractional skill levels<BR>
>> >because they are in the midst of acquiring skills, but the referee<BR>
>> >should always round down.<BR>
>><BR>
>> I disagree with this though..hand ME and Uzi with the safety on and I<BR>
can't<BR>
>> gurantee I could fire it in a pinch.  Simple pistols and rifles are<BR>
another<BR>
>> matter entirely and I feel confident with them.<BR>
><BR>
>OTOH, hand you the same SMG, and give you five minutes of<BR>
>familiarization, and you'd probably do all right. A short<BR>
>familiarization period doesn't equate to skill level 1, but it is<BR>
>appropriate for skill level 1/2 or 0 (depending on the ruleset in<BR>
>question).<BR>
><BR>
>Don't forget, the original character generation system (LBB 1) has Gun<BR>
>Combat skill available in _all_ branches.  The only LBB 1 branch that<BR>
>doesn't offer Blade Combat is the Scout service.  Given the widespread<BR>
>nature of weapons training in LBB 1, it is not unreasonable to assume<BR>
>that, in the course of a career, a character would receive at least<BR>
>rudimentary training in other weapons.<BR>
><BR>
>--<BR>
>AuricTech Shipyards Journeyman Gearhead<BR>
>"Gold-Plated [tm] solutions for copper-plated problems!" (r)<BR>
>http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Shadowlands/9776<BR>
><BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 29 Oct 1999 22:18:53 -0700<BR>
From: Jesse DeGraff <jdegraff@pacbell.net><BR>
Subject: Re: [OT] One Day In Peace<BR>
<BR>
Probably a good idea since the water gets muddied with major cultural<BR>
differences :)<BR>
Jesse<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Japanese kids watch cartoons, movies, and tv shows that are more violent<BR>
than what we see in North America, and they play more violent video games.<BR>
Yet the crime rate over there is much lower than it is here. However, since<BR>
I do not want to start (yet another) debate about the Second Amendment, I<BR>
will refrain from drawing a conclusion in this forum. :-D<BR>
<BR>
- -- g<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
     Glenn St-Germain  Edmonton, Alberta, Canada<BR>
cos90@powersurfr.com  http://plaza.powersurfr.com/glenn<BR>
        "There is no longer any normal to be"<BR>
                                 -- Gary Numan<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 29 Oct 1999 22:35:30 -0700<BR>
From: Jesse DeGraff <jdegraff@pacbell.net><BR>
Subject: Re: Yet more 3D work<BR>
<BR>
Well, since I'm a LW'er, I don't look much for Max stuff  :)  However, if<BR>
you go to www.scifi-art.com, then go to "The Discovery Zone", they have a<BR>
tutorial on how to model the 1701A Enterprise.  That may be a good place to<BR>
start.  Best o' luck!<BR>
<BR>
Jesse<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
- -----Original Message-----<BR>
From: Juliean Galak <jg42@cornell.edu><BR>
To: traveller@lists.imagiconline.com <traveller@lists.imagiconline.com><BR>
Date: Friday, October 29, 1999 8:32 PM<BR>
Subject: Re: Yet more 3D work<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
>While we are on the topic, does anyone have any pointers to 3D Studio Max<BR>
>tutorials that demonstrate how to model spaceship-like objects.  About 90%<BR>
>of the tutorials I've seen deal with how to make various "Effects",<BR>
>something I don't need right now.  The rest seem to be split between stuff<BR>
>on textures (which I'll need later), and organic looking stuff.  I on the<BR>
>other hand, want to learn to model really non-organic objects.  Things like<BR>
>Star Wars or B5 (the humans) spaceships, blasters, etc.<BR>
><BR>
>Furthermore, it would be nice if the tutorial would discuss<BR>
>generalities.  There are all too many tutorials out there that are along<BR>
>the lines of "Here's how to model a banana" that teach nothing more than<BR>
>how to model bananas, without addressing more general features of the<BR>
tools.<BR>
><BR>
>If anyone has a pointer to this sort of stuff, I'd greatly appreciate it.<BR>
><BR>
><BR>
>           -- Juliean Galak (a.k.a. Falcon)<BR>
>      Gearhead-in-Training<BR>
><BR>
>--<BR>
>Gerfalcon Enterprises - GURPS Traveller Ironmongery for the 5th Millenium<BR>
>IMTU tc  t4+ tg++ tt? ru ge++ 3i+ c+ jt au@ st+ ls+ pi-(+)<BR>
> ta- he+ kk-- hi+ as++ va++ dr+ so+ zh++ vi+ 0601<BR>
>jg42@cornell.edu        "I do not agree with a word you say, but I will<BR>
>                          defend to the death your right to say it."<BR>
>                                              -- Francois Marie Voltaire<BR>
>#include <disclaimer.h> "Imagination is more important than knowledge"<BR>
>                               -- Albert Einstein<BR>
>for PGP public-key and<BR>
>more quotes,  http://gerfalcon.tzo.com/plan.htm<BR>
>Traveller WWW Page: http://gerfalcon.tzo.com/Traveller/<BR>
><BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 29 Oct 1999 22:38:28 -0700<BR>
From: Jesse DeGraff <jdegraff@pacbell.net><BR>
Subject: Re: Yet more 3D work<BR>
<BR>
I don't have any experience with PovRay, but someone on this list used it<BR>
IIRC.....<BR>
Jesse<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
- -----Original Message-----<BR>
From: Shimmergloom <shimmer@mhtc.net><BR>
To: traveller@lists.imagiconline.com <traveller@lists.imagiconline.com><BR>
Date: Friday, October 29, 1999 8:11 PM<BR>
Subject: Re: Yet more 3D work<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
>Somebody mentioned that POVRAY was free.  How easy to use is povray?  Is it<BR>
>worth the time to download it because it is obviously worth the price of<BR>
>nothing.<BR>
><BR>
>----------------------------------------------<BR>
>he he he he he he he he he he he he<BR>
><BR>
>      Shimmer<BR>
><BR>
><BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 29 Oct 1999 22:43:48 -0700<BR>
From: Jesse DeGraff <jdegraff@pacbell.net><BR>
Subject: Trav3D resend<BR>
<BR>
My apologies, but could the individuals that were interested in the Trav3D<BR>
project please e-mail me again?  I seem to have lost the messages when I was<BR>
converting my mail account from my slip.net account on my 33.6 laptop to my<BR>
desktop with DSL.<BR>
<BR>
Please send directly to me (we're clogging the list enough as it is ;) with<BR>
Trav3D [no spaces and get the caps right :)   ] in the subject line so it<BR>
filters correctly.<BR>
<BR>
Very Best,<BR>
Jesse<BR>
jdegraff@pacbell.net<BR>
http://www.vision-forge-graphics.com/jesse/traveller/trav_welcome.htm<BR>
"Striving to Produce a Better (Illustrated) Traveller Universe"  (tm)<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 30 Oct 1999 00:52:29 -0500<BR>
From: "Eris Reddoch" <eris@pcola.gulf.net><BR>
Subject: re: Just say "no" to lhy for jump drives<BR>
<BR>
On 10/29/99 at 04:04 PM,  Walter Smith <SmithW@HARTWICK.EDU> said:<BR>
<BR>
>Eris, since IYTU Astrogators seem to be detecting the jumpspace<BR>
>signatures of stars, do instruments exist that can detect other<BR>
>jumpspace phenomena?<BR>
<BR>
>Say, for instance, a ship sitting at the 150 diameter limit, waiting<BR>
>for it's jump bubble to dissipate?<BR>
<BR>
Not at this point.  I won't rule out the possibility, though.  <g><BR>
It's the same with the possibility of FTL stutterwarp, not at this<BR>
point, but *perhaps* possible.<BR>
<BR>
>That could be a very scary invention for a system defense force to<BR>
>develop. "OK, park that asteroid right about *here*."<BR>
<BR>
Yep, it sure would.  That's why even if it's theoritically possible<BR>
it won't happen...at least not as more than a fluke.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Eris<BR>
- -- <BR>
- -----------------------------------------------------------<BR>
"Eris Reddoch" <eris@pcola.gulf.net>    using MR/2 ICE #245<BR>
- -----------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 29 Oct 1999 23:21:13 -0700<BR>
From: "Zane H. Healy" <healyzh@aracnet.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Alderson Drives and the MiGE Universe (was Re: Traveller: Aberrant jump drives (was Re: Just say "no" to lhyd))<BR>
<BR>
>needs a well thought out setup.  I don't think either Pournelle or<BR>
>Nivin rpg, or have any interest in rpging.  I'd also lay you odds<BR>
<BR>
I don't know about conventional paper-based gaming, but Pournelle seems to<BR>
be fairly into computer games based on his 'Byte' articles.<BR>
<BR>
				Zane<BR>
| Zane H. Healy                    | UNIX Systems Adminstrator  |<BR>
| healyzh@aracnet.com (primary)    | Linux Enthusiast           |<BR>
| healyzh@holonet.net (alternate)  | Classic Computer Collector |<BR>
+----------------------------------+----------------------------+<BR>
|     Empire of the Petal Throne and Traveller Role Playing,    |<BR>
|                   and Zane's Computer Museum.                 |<BR>
|                 http://www.aracnet.com/~healyzh/              |<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 30 Oct 1999 19:23:28 +1000<BR>
From: "cjbrain" <cjbrain@bigpond.com><BR>
Subject: Hi All! & Starports Question<BR>
<BR>
Hi All! I'm back on the list again and back home in the Torres Strait,<BR>
Australia once more. Just a quick couple of questions, is GT: Starports out<BR>
yet? If not, when is it due?<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 30 Oct 1999 23:22:18 +1300<BR>
From: "Frank Pitt" <frankie@mundens.gen.nz><BR>
Subject: Re: Yet more 3D work<BR>
<BR>
> I don't have any experience with PovRay, but someone on this list used it<BR>
> IIRC.....<BR>
><BR>
> >Somebody mentioned that POVRAY was free.  How easy to use is povray?  Is<BR>
it<BR>
> >worth the time to download it because it is obviously worth the price of<BR>
> >nothing.<BR>
<BR>
I've used povray, and it's very easy to use, but at least back when I use it<BR>
the problem was that it's _just_ a renderer .<BR>
<BR>
It doesn't really provide you with any tools for interactively designing<BR>
anything, you describe all the points, the textures, and the lighting in a<BR>
_text_ file, and then tell povray  to render it.<BR>
<BR>
Really easy to use for spheres & squares, etc, but very hard to define<BR>
complex 3D objects,  though some people have done some amazing work with it.<BR>
If you have some too that can provide you with a three-dimensional point<BR>
map, then PovRay can render it.<BR>
<BR>
There are other options out there.  Bryce is nowhere near as expensive as<BR>
Light Wave and it has a much better and easier to use interface than<BR>
LightWave, though obvioulsy it's not as powerful.<BR>
<BR>
Bryce also let's you do complete scenes nicely, as it includes Vista-Pro<BR>
type landscape tools as well as cloud maps, and specific lighting tools for<BR>
replicating the effect of a light source through cloud /haze/fog<BR>
<BR>
Frankie<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 30 Oct 1999 10:43:34 +0100<BR>
From: Shane Nicholas Thomas <shane.thomas@bigfoot.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Yet more 3D work  <BR>
<BR>
Michael D. Peters said:<BR>
<BR>
> All I have to say is that, dispite my wife's constant whi... er, compla....<BR>
> unheh, suggestion, I guess I haven't spent enough hours at it yet! Those are<BR>
> darn good!<BR>
<BR>
Thanks for the praise!  Being single helps I guess, although I'm sure that<BR>
before I started on this 3D stuff I had a social life (it seems to have<BR>
wandered off somewhere else whilst I wasn't looking).<BR>
<BR>
> What program are youworking in? I'd guess light wave..? THere's<BR>
> something about the lighting that reminds me of some of Jesse's work. It one<BR>
> of the areas tha I really have to work on in Raydream, mostly I just use<BR>
> defaults (and it shows).<BR>
<BR>
The model is handcrafted POV-Ray as I find a programming language easier than<BR>
using a modeller. (So far at least: Daedalus is mostly made from primitives,<BR>
with a couple of lathe objects - no meshes.  I guess doing those by hand<BR>
would cause my social life to leave me for good!)<BR>
<BR>
Actually, the main reason I used POV-Ray is because it's free and I wanted to<BR>
see if I enjoyed 3D work (which I do) and if I had any talent at it, before<BR>
spending good money on other software.<BR>
<BR>
The image maps are produced using The GIMP which seems to be an extremely<BR>
powerful package (i.e. I don't understand 90% of the facilities available.<BR>
Before creating the maps for Daedalus I had never used anything more<BR>
complicated than a basic paint program).<BR>
<BR>
As for the lighting, it's very simple.  No ambient lighting for those harsh<BR>
shadows, and a single large light a long way away for the star.  Oh, and a<BR>
another bright light sitting in the engine if it's switched on!<BR>
<BR>
Shane<BR>
<BR>
- --<BR>
Shane Thomas                              shane.thomas@traveller.cjb.net<BR>
Physicist and wannabe 3D artist           Oxford, UK<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 30 Oct 1999 12:29:20 +0200 (METDST)<BR>
From: Hans Rancke-Madsen <rancke@diku.dk><BR>
Subject: Re: Just say no to lhyd for jump drives<BR>
<BR>
Walter Smith writes:<BR>
<BR>
>Eris, since IYTU Astrogators seem to be detecting the jumpspace<BR>
>signatures of stars, do instruments exist that can detect other<BR>
>jumpspace phenomena?<BR>
> <BR>
>Say, for instance, a ship sitting at the 150 diameter limit, waiting for<BR>
>it's jump bubble to dissipate?<BR>
> <BR>
>That could be a very scary invention for a system defense force to<BR>
>develop. "OK, park that asteroid right about *here*."<BR>
 <BR>
I don't know. The odds against anyone being able to park an asteroid at any<BR>
particular spot 150 diameters out from a planet at a week's notice are<BR>
literally astronomical.<BR>
<BR>
The odds of them being able to get a military vessel into shooting range are<BR>
better. Whether they would want to depends on whether they are able to<BR>
determine the size of the arriving ship...<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
      Hans Rancke<BR>
University of Copenhagen<BR>
     rancke@diku.dk<BR>
- ------------<BR>
        "Even sub-lieutenants are God's creatures,<BR>
         though it is hard to believe it sometimes."<BR>
                        Commander Ted Walker<BR>
                   "Secret Water" by Arthur Ransome<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 30 Oct 1999 07:26:28 -0400<BR>
From: "DaveShayne" <daveshayne@email.msn.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Tust say "no" to lhy for Jump drives<BR>
<BR>
>Date: Sat, 30 Oct 1999 12:20:17 +1300<BR>
>From: "Rupert Boleyn" <rboleyn@paradise.net.nz><BR>
>Subject: Re: Just say "no" to lhy for Jump drives<BR>
<BR>
>On 27 Oct 99, at 16:19, Joseph R. Dietrich wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>> >Can the jump capacitors be charged up before exiting<BR>
>> >jump space?<BR>
>><BR>
>> I don't like it, but possibly. I am having a hard time thinking of a<BR>
>> handwave to prevent this. I would like them to have to spend some time in<BR>
>> realspace between jumps -- but I suppose you could make a ship with a<BR>
>> power plant so big that you could fill the capacitors in a second anyway<BR>
>> sooo...<BR>
>><BR>
>> Hmm. Perhaps each jump requires astrogation observations and calculations<BR>
>> that can take up to a couple of hours to perform.<BR>
<BR>
>TSR's Alternity SFRPG (which owes an aweful lot to Traveller, IMO) has<BR>
>it that you lose a 'tachyon charge' during jump that needs to be<BR>
>replenished in normal space before you can jump again. Perhaps some<BR>
>mechanism like that would be of use.<BR>
<BR>
OK so I'm not trying to start a flame war or anything but whenever I read,<BR>
hear,<BR>
touch, or smell the word tachyon as an explanation for something in scifi I<BR>
want<BR>
to scream. The thing about tachyons is that they don't interact with normal<BR>
mater<BR>
so even if they do exist we'll never know it.<BR>
<BR>
Having said that an idea on how to get the pc's to land on a regular basis<BR>
has<BR>
just hit me. This is based on the description of the air filter problems on<BR>
the type S<BR>
scout from Suplement 7.<BR>
<BR>
The air/water recycling that takes place on a starship has a limited<BR>
cappacity<BR>
to work after a short period of time, Say 1 month with single occupancy<BR>
two weeks or so with double occupancy. After that time The air begins to<BR>
stink to<BR>
high heaven and the recycled water begins to taste like it's primary source<BR>
material.<BR>
<BR>
These problems get worse as time goes by with stench building upon stench<BR>
untill<BR>
it becomes unbearable. Simply opening the locks to a breathable atmosphere<BR>
for a day or two and flushing the recyc mechanisms will solve the problem<BR>
in most cases.<BR>
<BR>
You can increase comfort endurance by providing extra stateroom equivalents<BR>
at 1<BR>
person/month per SR, or alternatively overcrowd on a short term basis with<BR>
the<BR>
smell starting almost imediately.<BR>
<BR>
There are no doubt Realworld problems with this approach but I think it's<BR>
pretty good as handwaves go.<BR>
<BR>
>- --<BR>
>Rupert Boleyn <paradise.net.nz><BR>
>Wellington, New Zealand<BR>
<BR>
>A pessimist is an optimist with a sense of history.<BR>
<BR>
Hope this helps.<BR>
Dave<BR>
daveshayne@msn.com<BR>
<BR>
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++<BR>
Old version - Build a better mousetrap and the world will beat<BR>
a path to your dooor. New version - Build a beter mousetrap<BR>
and some @$*% will build a beter mouse.<BR>
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 30 Oct 1999 09:03:01 -0400<BR>
From: "DaveShayne" <daveshayne@email.msn.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Wizard of Oz (Was Re: Traveller economics)<BR>
<BR>
>Date: Fri, 29 Oct 1999 18:13:54 -0400<BR>
>From: jmaclean@ix.netcom.com<BR>
>Subject: Re: Traveller economics<BR>
<BR>
</FONT><FONT  SIZE=3 PTSIZE=14><BIG><BIG><BIG><BR>
<BR>
>*There's an intriguing story that the original Wizard of >Oz book was<BR>
actually a turn-of-the-century populist >political tract advocating a switch<BR>
from the gold to the >silver standard for the US dollar.  The price of gold<BR>
>had been going up at the end of the century causing >deflation, raising the<BR>
real value of debts.  Farmers >and other folks agitated for the silver<BR>
standard >because the value of silver was dropping, which >would cause<BR>
inflation and lower the real value of their >debts.  Sounds like a<BR>
net.rumor, I know, but I heard it >on PBS, so it must be true :-)<BR>
<BR>
Lets see. In the book the slippers were silver, so that<BR>
ties in with the free silver movement. But the allegories don't stop there.<BR>
The tin woodsman looking for a heart<BR>
seems like an obvious stand in for the industrialists of the time. The<BR>
cowardly lion, skilled at picking on the small and weak but afraid of a real<BR>
fight seems to be saying something about the US military of the time. (We'd<BR>
just got through with the spanish american war and at the time were involved<BR>
in a resonably brutal little war to pacify the philipines.) The scarecrow<BR>
looking for a brain could very well have to do with the grange movement. I<BR>
can't remember who the president was at the time but I'm willing to bet that<BR>
the populist movement viewed him as a talentless blowhard ala the wizard.<BR>
Dorothy is just some snot nosed kid from  kansas.<BR>
<BR>
In other childrens book ramblings most of the Dr. Seuss books have political<BR>
subtexts to them as well.<BR>
Most notably The Lorax, Horton Hears a Who, and The 500 Hats of Bartholomew<BR>
Cubbins (sp?).<BR>
<BR>
The Mother goose nursery rhymes are also said to be originally of a<BR>
political bent, but the only paralells I can find are possibly, Peter, Peter<BR>
Pumpkin Eater = Peter the Great, and George III = Humpty Dumpty<BR>
<BR>
OK my OB Trav is this<BR>
<BR>
The PC's have a hold full of childrens books to unload on a high Law world.<BR>
<BR>
1) Unfortunately they are deemed "subversive" by the repressive world<BR>
government leading to perhaps serious consequences.<BR>
<BR>
2) They know the books are political tracts in disguise because they've been<BR>
hired by the local liberation movement to import them. The trick here is to<BR>
get them passed the customs officials looking for same.<BR>
<BR>
3) The same adventure hooks as have been suggested for the poet patron on<BR>
another thread will probably work too.<BR>
<BR>
Dave<BR>
<BR>
daveshayne@msn.com<BR>
<BR>
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++<BR>
Old version - Build a better mousetrap and<BR>
the world will beat a path to your door.<BR>
New version - Build a better mousetrap and<BR>
some @$*% will build a better mouse.<BR>
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 30 Oct 1999 09:47:07 -0400 (EDT)<BR>
From: Robert Prior <robert_prior@sympatico.ca><BR>
Subject: RE: How many contacts to span the Imperium?<BR>
<BR>
>So perhaps you'd be more PC-ish and I'd be like one of those people that<BR>
>always runs the same route between 2-3 planets (in my case, Ohio,<BR>
>California, Japan, and occasional stops in HK, Taiwan, and Singapore... I<BR>
>have ONE friend in Indonesia, but we're not as close as we used to be<BR>
>because she doesn't like Hiroshi.)<BR>
<BR>
I've only visited Europe and the USA, less than two dozen trips in all. Not<BR>
well-travelled.<BR>
<BR>
I'm definately not a PC.  More of a useful contact, who generally knows<BR>
someone who the PCs would want to meet. Hm. Yup, that's definately it: I'm<BR>
an NPC contact! Nice to know my place... :-)<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 30 Oct 1999 10:17:55 -0400<BR>
From: "Micheal D. Peters" <Travelleri@home.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Yet more 3D work<BR>
<BR>
Seem to me that I've seen some free modeling interfaces out there for<BR>
POV-ray. I'd go to the main site (the address escapes me) and look for<BR>
links.<BR>
<BR>
Moray is one that comes to mind. THere are others.<BR>
<BR>
Another freebie out there is blender. I dl'd it and found that is appeared<BR>
to have A LOT of features, in fact, possible too many. The interface was<BR>
very cluttered and not really intuative... But it is FREE ;). here's an<BR>
adress to check it out.<BR>
<BR>
http://www.blender.nl/<BR>
<BR>
Mike<BR>
- ----- Original Message -----<BR>
From: Frank Pitt <frankie@mundens.gen.nz><BR>
To: <traveller@lists.imagiconline.com><BR>
Sent: Saturday, October 30, 1999 6:22 AM<BR>
Subject: Re: Yet more 3D work<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
><BR>
><BR>
> > I don't have any experience with PovRay, but someone on this list used<BR>
it<BR>
> > IIRC.....<BR>
> ><BR>
> > >Somebody mentioned that POVRAY was free.  How easy to use is povray?<BR>
Is<BR>
> it<BR>
> > >worth the time to download it because it is obviously worth the price<BR>
of<BR>
> > >nothing.<BR>
><BR>
> I've used povray, and it's very easy to use, but at least back when I use<BR>
it<BR>
> the problem was that it's _just_ a renderer .<BR>
><BR>
> It doesn't really provide you with any tools for interactively designing<BR>
> anything, you describe all the points, the textures, and the lighting in a<BR>
> _text_ file, and then tell povray  to render it.<BR>
><BR>
> Really easy to use for spheres & squares, etc, but very hard to define<BR>
> complex 3D objects,  though some people have done some amazing work with<BR>
it.<BR>
> If you have some too that can provide you with a three-dimensional point<BR>
> map, then PovRay can render it.<BR>
><BR>
> There are other options out there.  Bryce is nowhere near as expensive as<BR>
> Light Wave and it has a much better and easier to use interface than<BR>
> LightWave, though obvioulsy it's not as powerful.<BR>
><BR>
> Bryce also let's you do complete scenes nicely, as it includes Vista-Pro<BR>
> type landscape tools as well as cloud maps, and specific lighting tools<BR>
for<BR>
> replicating the effect of a light source through cloud /haze/fog<BR>
><BR>
> Frankie<BR>
><BR>
><BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 30 Oct 1999 10:26:11 -0400<BR>
From: "Micheal D. Peters" <Travelleri@home.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Yet more 3D work<BR>
<BR>
Juliean,<BR>
<BR>
Not exactly a space ship tutorial but close. Here's an adress for a tutorial<BR>
on using 3DSM to model an UFO. Som of it might give you a couple of ideas.<BR>
It looks fairly quick and dirty. Oh and look at other softwares tutorials<BR>
to. About half of the ones I have book marked are for other stuff. Most of<BR>
the principals are the same, if not the actual mechanics.<BR>
<BR>
http://www.teenworld.com.my/3dsmaxclub/3DJoe/Tutorials.htm<BR>
<BR>
Mike<BR>
<BR>
- ----- Original Message -----<BR>
From: Juliean Galak <jg42@cornell.edu><BR>
To: <traveller@lists.imagiconline.com><BR>
Sent: Friday, October 29, 1999 11:27 PM<BR>
Subject: Re: Yet more 3D work<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
> While we are on the topic, does anyone have any pointers to 3D Studio Max<BR>
> tutorials that demonstrate how to model spaceship-like objects.  About 90%<BR>
> of the tutorials I've seen deal with how to make various "Effects",<BR>
> something I don't need right now.  The rest seem to be split between stuff<BR>
> on textures (which I'll need later), and organic looking stuff.  I on the<BR>
> other hand, want to learn to model really non-organic objects.  Things<BR>
like<BR>
> Star Wars or B5 (the humans) spaceships, blasters, etc.<BR>
><BR>
> Furthermore, it would be nice if the tutorial would discuss<BR>
> generalities.  There are all too many tutorials out there that are along<BR>
> the lines of "Here's how to model a banana" that teach nothing more than<BR>
> how to model bananas, without addressing more general features of the<BR>
tools.<BR>
><BR>
> If anyone has a pointer to this sort of stuff, I'd greatly appreciate it.<BR>
><BR>
><BR>
>            -- Juliean Galak (a.k.a. Falcon)<BR>
>      Gearhead-in-Training<BR>
><BR>
> --<BR>
> Gerfalcon Enterprises - GURPS Traveller Ironmongery for the 5th Millenium<BR>
> IMTU tc  t4+ tg++ tt? ru ge++ 3i+ c+ jt au@ st+ ls+ pi-(+)<BR>
> ta- he+ kk-- hi+ as++ va++ dr+ so+ zh++ vi+ 0601<BR>
> jg42@cornell.edu        "I do not agree with a word you say, but I will<BR>
>                           defend to the death your right to say it."<BR>
>                                               -- Francois Marie Voltaire<BR>
> #include <disclaimer.h> "Imagination is more important than knowledge"<BR>
>                                -- Albert Einstein<BR>
> for PGP public-key and<BR>
> more quotes,  http://gerfalcon.tzo.com/plan.htm<BR>
> Traveller WWW Page: http://gerfalcon.tzo.com/Traveller/<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 30 Oct 1999 10:47:07 -0400 (EDT)<BR>
From: Robert Prior <robert_prior@sympatico.ca><BR>
Subject: Re: [OT] One Day In Peace<BR>
<BR>
>Probably a good idea since the water gets muddied with major cultural<BR>
>differences :)<BR>
>Jesse<BR>
><BR>
><BR>
><BR>
><BR>
>Japanese kids watch cartoons, movies, and tv shows that are more violent<BR>
>than what we see in North America, and they play more violent video games.<BR>
>Yet the crime rate over there is much lower than it is here. However, since<BR>
>I do not want to start (yet another) debate about the Second Amendment, I<BR>
>will refrain from drawing a conclusion in this forum. :-D<BR>
><BR>
>-- g<BR>
><BR>
><BR>
>     Glenn St-Germain  Edmonton, Alberta, Canada<BR>
<BR>
Yeah, well the Japanese don't eat cheese. So statistically, you could argue<BR>
that we should give up cheese!<BR>
<BR>
Correlation is not causation and all that.<BR>
<BR>
Kiri can correct me if I'm wrong, but my Japanese friends tell me that<BR>
Japan has a much higher level of social control than America. Leave your<BR>
trash can out of place on the curb and the "trash lady" comes to warn you.<BR>
Keep doing it and the neighbourhood reacts. This factor should be taken<BR>
into account.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
End of Traveller-digest V1999 #1279<BR>
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